Conversation with #inferno at Sun Jan 30 16:16:53 2011 on powerman-asdf@irc.freenode.net (irc)
(17:12:45) base2design: i've seen gripes about not having unix domain sockets in inferno (i.e. not portable to "all" platforms), but has anyone made a devWHATEVER for this?
(17:13:08) base2design: (didn't see anything in the archives or contrib, but perhaps my google skills are lame)
(17:14:49) base2design: (i'm trying to introduce inferno logging into syslog a simple way... granted i guess i could write a 9p server in c-space and "proxy" that traffic to syslog, but that sure seems ugly)
(17:15:32) base2design: MrWGW: solaris on osx? under a vm? was it x86 solaris or sparc solaris?
(17:17:15) base2design: oh, another reason i brought up unix-domain sockets is that i'm wondering if avoiding part of the IP stack might help speed-wise (although i wonder if the localhost interface is pretty efficient already w.r.t. to gratuitous copying of data)
(17:23:39) mjl-: base2design: haven't heard of a unix domain sockets device for inferno
(17:23:43) mjl-: but it can't be too hard
(17:24:15) mjl-: even more so if you only care about opening a socket from inferno, not serving one
(17:41:50) powerman: base2design: i've implemented logging to syslog from inferno
(17:42:05) powerman: without unix domain sockets
(17:43:08) powerman: i've just output from inferno to stdout/stderr in syslog format, and redirect emu's output to unix socket using 'socat' tool (sort of more general 'netcat')
(17:45:54) powerman: here is it: http://code.google.com/p/inferno-contrib-logger/
(17:46:33) powerman: description a little outdated, doesn't mention output format compatibility with syslog
(17:47:47) powerman: run it like this: emu 2>&1 | socat - UNIX-SENDTO:/dev/log
(18:24:59) base2design: mjl: first step is just sending... maybe later serving
(18:26:18) base2design: powerman-asdf: neat. i want a more direct solution as this is an embedded platform, so i'll look at how hard it is do add system calls to emu.
(18:26:54) base2design: of course, i guess i could ask the team to enable syslog via udp (port 514)...
(18:27:35) base2design: indeed, i mistakenly thought it was enabled by default and wondered why my log wasn't showing up
(18:29:46) base2design: powerman-asdf: that makes me thing that another approach to avoid messing up the emu core with my crappy code would be to find a clean way to pass a file descriptor to emu after it has been started.
(18:29:55) base2design: anyone know of prior art on this?
(18:30:19) powerman: probably you can temporary run socat as simple port forwarder from any udp port to unix domain socket as work around until syslog will not listen on 514
(18:30:57) base2design: how big is socat?
(18:31:35) base2design: is it one of those typical gnu things where the codebase is way bloated?
(18:32:27) powerman: 300 KB binary, 4.8MB VSZ, 780KB RSS
(18:33:42) mjl-: wait, can't you put a unix domain socket in the file system and just open it as a normal file?
(18:33:59) powerman: mjl-: no, this doesn't work from withing inferno
(18:34:28) mjl-: oh, ok
(18:34:29) powerman: unix domain sockets can't be opened using just open/fopen
(18:36:00) base2design: yikes that's almost as big as emu
(18:36:07) base2design: (on my target)
(18:36:29) powerman: base2design: there also 'logger' tool (from util-linux package on my gentoo)
(18:37:14) powerman: it's way smaller, but you can't control log level, ident, pid, date this way - it just post to syslog it's stdin
(18:37:24) base2design: yeah, i gotta find out why "os" crashes on my emu... a lot of things would open up once i fix that
(18:37:42) powerman: 9.7KB binary, 1.7MB VSZ, 400KB RSS
(18:38:18) base2design: nice. but i understand why socat is so big, it has way too many option ;-)
(18:39:05) base2design: who needs a swiss army knife when you only need a bowie knife ;-)
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(22:47:38) base2design: a
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(06:09:21) base2design: a
(06:23:36) btdn: b
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(09:39:01) mjl-: morning
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(12:24:25) MrWGW: base2design: I meant Inferno sorry
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(16:02:33) base2design: MrWGW: ah, that makes more sense to me!
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(00:30:42) MrWGW: base2design: that being said you *could* run Solaris on OS X using VirtualBox or probably VMware Fusion
(00:30:53) MrWGW: (Solaris runs fine in other VMware products)
(00:32:02) MrWGW: don't know about Parallels; that company is crappy enough to where you probably couldn't
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(15:32:08) base2design: Hmmm... i kinda like parallels. What problems have you had with it?
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(14:29:35) base2design: so if i want clients of my styx server to block on reads, is it as simple as delaying the transmission of the Rread message?
(14:36:40) mjl-: yes
(14:37:01) mjl-: but beware:  the client may send Tflush, and you must handle it
(15:53:39) base2design: mjl-: got it... i'm resurrecting my lua styx client code and haven't gotten to the tflush message yet (just handling tversion/tattach/twalk/tread/twrite/tclunk right now).
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(00:30:24) base2design: tclunk!
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(01:10:52) base2design: tclunk
(01:34:47) mjl-: rclunk
(01:37:08) base2design: :) - goofing around w/my irc client and didn't know if it was working...
(01:37:23) base2design: thanks for the Rmsg
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(18:58:03) sl: does inferno's acme support the full sam command language?
(18:59:10) mjl-: probably, it's supposed to be a direct port
(18:59:37) mjl-: perhaps plan 9's acme was extended later (probably not), or it depended on system libs that were not in inferno and porting wasn't done
(18:59:45) mjl-: better just check the code :P
(18:59:48) sl: ☺
(19:00:18) sl: i never thought to question it, but then i was looking through /acme/edit and the readme talks about offering a 'sam-like' interface through dis modules
(19:00:37) sl: basic sam commands seem to work, but i haven't tested much
(19:02:01) mjl-: sl: i saw your posts on openbsd-ports, drawterm & something else i can't recall now
(19:02:06) mjl-: did you get any response on that?
(19:02:22) sl: i'm not sure when acme was updated, but it didn't originally support sam commands.
(19:02:41) sl: re openbsd: i did receive a response on u9fs that they would check it out after the lock
(19:02:47) sl: nothing on the others though
(19:03:06) sl: i made ports for drawterm, 9base and u9fs
(19:03:21) mjl-: somewhat good.  i suppose a problem they'll have is that they won't have a plan 9 system to connect to (drawterm) or from (u9fs)
(19:03:34) mjl-: but perhaps they don't require functional testing
(19:04:27) sl: i believe they rely mostly on the list to police itself
(19:04:40) sl: broken packages manage to ship, from time to time. :)
(19:06:22) mjl-: i should test the packages and respond on the list that (whether) they work, perhaps that helps a bit
(19:06:35) sl: i would appreciate that a lot!
(19:06:54) mjl-: best to test against a current install right?
(19:07:02) sl: yes, although i also tested them on 4.8
(19:07:16) mjl-: ok.  it'll take a week before i'm back near a pc that i can test on.
(19:07:24) sl: the package system has changed a bit in the interim, but they built okay for me on both
(19:07:31) sl: np, thanks very much
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(03:13:30) dreadlorde: is createsignerkey supposed to take a while and use a lot of cpu?
(03:14:10) dreadlorde: /who
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(06:31:06) cbj: me test ircfs
(06:31:26) ***cbj test ircfs
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(17:58:29) cbj: hi
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(03:53:20) jas: has anyone here ever worked with MODBUS?
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(10:30:03) mjl-: hadn't heard of modbus before you just mentioned it
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(03:12:20) base2design: heard of it... never worked with it... you doing inferno stuff with it?
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(04:18:36) jas: writing up an initial Modbus Inferno module
(04:19:08) jas: wondering if it would be worth it to go all out and turn it into a 9p service through Inferno
(04:19:55) jas: pros: get rid of the modbus hideous API, enable more inferno front ends for industrial components
(04:20:17) jas: cons: hideous modbus API
(04:41:34) GriffenJBS: is Noah Evans ever on here?
(04:47:35) anth_r: infrequently.
(04:52:50) GriffenJBS: I'm still trying to inferno-ds to go, so far no luck
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(15:24:06) GriffenJBS: this is not good, I would expect an error to keep mk from finishing, but I forgot a function and the linker complained but still output the file and installed
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(23:04:51) mjl-: hah
(23:05:03) mjl-: i got a working (or so it seems) emu binary for openbsd
(23:05:10) mjl-: compiled with the inferno native compilers
(23:05:38) mjl-: (not using any openbsd headers, and no libraries either of course)
(23:06:03) mjl-: so also no x11
(23:06:08) mjl-: but it does have networking
(23:06:29) mjl-: given equis on plan 9, i bet the x11 libs are portable enough to compile them with 8c
(23:06:43) mjl-: so i probably just have to implement more of libc
(23:11:11) anth_x: ooo.
(23:11:30) anth_x: what's translating between 8c's a.out and openbsd's?
(23:11:49) _sl: nice!
(23:12:46) mjl-: a little program ioaout (inferno to openbsd aout)
(23:12:50) mjl-: i use openbsd's aout support
(23:12:52) mjl-: they now use elf
(23:13:00) mjl-: but the kernel can still execute a.out
(23:13:14) mjl-: the header is very similar
(23:13:16) anth_x: is ioaout a static translator?
(23:13:31) mjl-: it just rewrites the header
(23:13:49) mjl-: and inserts the header in the text too (openbsd doesn't have it in hte text, inferno does)
(23:14:26) mjl-: http://www.ueber.net/who/mjl/tmp/ioaout.c
(23:15:17) mjl-: it could be smaller, but i had to figure out how to do it and wanted all info accessible in structures.  it turned out to be easy :)
(23:15:35) anth_x: that's pretty exciting. know if any of the other BSDs (or anyone else, i guess) support that a.out?
(23:16:05) mjl-: i'm not very familiar with other bsd's, but having some aout support makes sense
(23:16:16) mjl-: though i wouldn't be surprised if this could easily be wrapped in elf headers too
(23:16:20) mjl-: it's just a text and data area
(23:16:48) mjl-: (ioaout has the "side effect" of stripping the symbols table and debugging info, perhaps they could be translated too)
(23:17:52) mjl-: btw, the first step in getting to a "natively" compiled emu was compiling it with gcc without system includes/libraries
(23:18:42) mjl-: being able to use the native compilers also means i can compile openbsd binaries on windows!  profit!!!1
(23:19:03) anth_x: aside from the part where you're using windows. ;-)
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(01:21:54) base2design: mjl: that's very nice!
(05:01:54) GriffenJBS: mjl you had helped me before with inferno-ds right?
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(11:04:04) mjl-: GriffenJBS: yes
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