Conversation with #inferno at Thu Feb 17 18:50:20 2011 on powerman-asdf@irc.freenode.net (irc)
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(15:16:32) linschn [~klein_edo@klein.metz.supelec.fr] entered the room.
(15:25:14) linschn: Hi ! I would like to know if there is any resource on how to program in C with Inferno running as a Linux app. There is 8c, but it is not executable from inferno. When I try to compile from Linux, it does not find u.h. I then tried to explicitely include Inferno/386/include, where u.h lies, but libc.h is nowhere to be found. Is there a way to program in C with inferno, or shall I switch to plan9 ?
(15:30:46) mjl-: linschn: did you set SYSTARG=Inferno in mkconfig?
(15:31:14) mjl-: hmm, don't think it should be necessary
(15:31:40) linschn: I didn't use mk
(15:31:43) mjl-: i can just cd into os/pc/ and run "mk", and that gets me a 386 kernel
(15:32:07) linschn: I am trying to compile one of my own programs
(15:32:11) mjl-: ah
(15:32:21) mjl-: and you want to do that with the inferno libraries?  or the inferno compilers?
(15:33:09) linschn: I would like my program to run on a few different boxes, under inferno
(15:33:27) linschn: And the mount its service on a different box and use it from there
(15:33:44) mjl-: then the program should be in limbo
(15:34:12) linschn: Oh. Limbo is the only way to program under Inferno ?
(15:34:22) mjl-: you can't normally run c programs in inferno (unless by the "os" command, but that just executes a program in the underlying OS)
(15:34:29) mjl-: yes
(15:34:57) linschn: I didn't expect that.
(15:34:58) mjl-: you can write c, but then you must link it into emu
(15:35:57) linschn: Pardon me if I am slow. But it is possible to run C programs under plan 9, why not under Inferno ?
(15:36:29) robot12: linschn: Inferno != Plan9 :) 
(15:36:40) mjl-: inferno itself runs as a program/process under eg linux, windows, mac os x
(15:36:41) robot12: Inferno have a VM (dis) 
(15:37:08) mjl-: so it would have to emulate processes (which can do arbitrarily complex OS things, with fork, threads, registers)
(15:37:17) robot12: no only :) Inferno have a standalone kernel 
(15:37:54) mjl-: true, it should be possible to adapt a native inferno (i.e. inferno on real hardware) to run c programs
(15:38:06) mjl-: but then it's pretty much plan 9 :)
(15:38:33) linschn: And how much effort would it be to port ken-cc to output dis executables, on a scale from hard to impossible ?
(15:39:24) robot12: why not limbo ???
(15:39:34) mjl-: i would say impossible, but it depends on which syscalls the c programs compiled by kencc uses
(15:39:52) linschn: I have a consequent code base in C :(
(15:40:01) robot12: U may write on Java :) 
(15:40:29) mjl-: linschn: you could use inferno for managing execution of c programs
(15:40:32) mjl-: that has been done before
(15:40:51) mjl-: but unfortunately there's no way to interface those programs with inferno's namespaces/mounts.  so it probably doesn't apply to your case.
(15:40:51) robot12: he he Inferno as a scheduler :) 
(15:41:15) robot12: linschn: man c2l 
(15:41:59) robot12: translate your codebase to limbo 
(15:42:19) robot12: and use mo features of Limbo !
(15:43:39) linschn: Thanks. I was willing to avoid Limbo, as it is limited to Inferno whereas C is portable. I guess I cannot cut it. Thank you both for your help.
(15:45:00) mjl-: np
(15:45:03) mjl-: too bad it won't work!
(15:45:07) linschn: I will come back if I run into problems translating to Limbo :)
(15:45:20) mjl-: ok :)
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(17:10:28) anth_x: note that while it's more work than simply compiling, you can often get good results building C code into emu as a module or file server.
(17:10:46) anth_x: i'm not sure if the distribution has any good examples of that...
(17:13:23) anth_x: no, i don't see any. that'd be good to have. i bet caerwyn's done one.
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