Conversation with #inferno at Tue Mar 15 02:41:38 2011 on powerman-asdf@irc.freenode.net (irc)
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(04:31:56) GriffenJBS: Well the problem is not what I thought it was, wm/wm can be started and restarted no problem, but using emu in windows create one display/window and closing that closes emu
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(10:32:36) mjl-: morning
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(14:48:32) base2design: howdy!
(14:49:43) mjl-: yo base2design!
(14:49:45) mjl-: what's up!
(14:50:23) base2design: slogging thru the day... wishing i could use limbo or go at work...
(14:50:35) base2design: ;)
(14:50:53) base2design: i guess there are worse problems in the world, though!
(14:51:32) mjl-: :)
(14:51:42) mjl-: life can always be worse :P
(14:51:49) mjl-: ah no, i'm an optimist
(14:52:21) mjl-: i still have to find a way to use <whatever i want to use> to make money
(14:52:35) mjl-: which would be inferno & limbo
(14:52:56) mjl-: but making any money should be my priority :)
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(15:20:42) GriffenJBS: Is there any way to multiplex /dev/draw instances? like Ctrl+Alt+Fn
(15:23:05) GriffenJBS: There is no way to kill wm/wm, like Ctrl+Alt+Backspace for X?
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(15:39:38) mjl-: in principle it is possible to have multiple displays, /dev/draw instances
(15:40:06) mjl-: but i wouldn't be surprised if emu is too intertwined with the display to have multiple
(15:40:14) mjl-: actually, it's not just /dev/draw
(15:40:20) mjl-: it's also the keyboard and the pointer
(15:40:27) mjl-: keyboard is in cons(3)
(15:40:42) mjl-: ah, pointer is there too
(15:41:28) mjl-: and cons(3) and draw(3) are separate.  so if you want to have multiple instances, you need a way to combine them.  to get the keyboard,pointer,draw/display in 1 namespace.
(15:41:45) mjl-: i always just start multiple emu's
(15:41:57) mjl-: what is your goal?  multiple workspaces?
(15:45:51) robot12: U may make /dev/draw :) just write server :) 
(15:45:57) robot12: like rio in Plan9 
(15:46:25) robot12: any layer in Plan9 has it's own /dev/draw :)
(15:46:48) robot12: U can start rio in rio :) 
(15:47:05) robot12: may be Inferno wm have same feature ??
(15:47:40) robot12: The way ti kill wm is to kill wm :) 
(15:48:12) robot12: but noone can do this thru keyboard 
(15:48:56) mjl-: wm/wm is not so generic unfortunately.  in inferno, each program gets a Draw->Context, which holds channels that give key & ptr events, and new images after resize.
(15:49:14) mjl-: the tkclient and wmclient libs create an initial draw->context if there is none
(15:50:29) mjl-: i don't mind using channels so much (instead of providing a namespace with a private draw,ptr,keyboard), but draw->context doesn't have a channel for letting the application move the mouse pointer
(15:58:59) mjl-: it could be that wm/wm came before rio?
(15:59:02) mjl-: not sure when rio was made
(16:16:57) robot12: hmm rio is oldie
(16:43:52) GriffenJBS: mjl-: It's not a requirement on my end, just usage patterns from linux/X that don't translate.
(16:45:49) GriffenJBS: it's the little things that drive you nuts... like sh and wm/edit not handling delete
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(16:51:39) mjl-: yeah, i especially find not having Del in sh annoying
(16:51:49) mjl-: i'm not calling it a little thing anymore
(16:52:11) GriffenJBS: lol
(16:52:50) GriffenJBS: tab completion in sh, command history; don't know what you have until it's gone
(16:53:01) mjl-: hehe, yeah
(16:53:05) mjl-: you could try my wm/run
(16:53:09) mjl-: it has some of that
(16:53:23) mjl-: namely:  tab copmletion, command history, vi-style editing
(16:53:39) mjl-: but it is missing some too, like mouse chording
(16:53:42) GriffenJBS: vi is a boat I missed, so is emacs
(16:53:51) mjl-: that's good
(16:53:58) mjl-: i'm addicted...
(16:54:24) mjl-: that's not too say i find it really great, but it's what i'm fastest with
(16:54:24) GriffenJBS: if you every quit vi, try the piano, the keys are simplier
(16:54:29) mjl-: changing habits takes too much time
(16:54:33) mjl-: hehe
(16:54:38) mjl-: i've played piano
(16:54:54) GriffenJBS: I've made noise on several
(16:55:02) GriffenJBS: I play the PC keyboard much better
(17:39:04) mjl-: i'm much better at that too, luckily
(17:40:19) mjl-: ok, i'm testing some new changes to ttffs & fontsrv, with a new patch to inferno-os.  all to get better fonts, which should also make it easier to get decent fonts in clones of inferno-os without the commercial fonts.
(17:47:09) GriffenJBS: has anyone checked on inferno in chrome using native client?
(17:47:17) GriffenJBS: NaCl in chrome
(17:48:57) GriffenJBS: mjl-: I'm not seeing any wm/run, and I just pulled/updated
(17:50:04) mjl-: GriffenJBS: it's not in inferno-os
(17:50:11) mjl-: http://www.ueber.net/code/r/wmrun
(18:11:48) GriffenJBS: mjl-: is util0.m something of yours?
(18:14:11) mjl-: es
(18:14:12) mjl-: yes*
(18:14:24) mjl-: i should use it less, it's annoying to have dependencies
(18:14:57) mjl-: i've just pushed the changes to fontsrv and ttffs, at http://www.ueber.net/code/
(18:15:15) mjl-: fontsrv has a diff against inferno-os to make it talk to fontsrv for font translations
(18:17:28) mjl-: util0 is in www.ueber.net/code/r/util
(18:17:34) mjl-: i'm modifying wm/run now to stop using it
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(18:21:10) mjl-: and its pushed
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(18:22:01) anth: stupid internet.
(18:26:42) GriffenJBS: mjl, I've already installed util0, but it showed another problem
(18:26:49) mjl-: oh?
(18:27:08) GriffenJBS: inferno (or rather sh) has problems with spaces in paths
(18:28:39) mjl-: and does that show in wm/run specifically?
(18:29:12) GriffenJBS: I noticed it in util0, $ROOT/mkfiles/mksubdirs was dying on the space in my username
(18:29:15) mjl-: or, how does it even show in sh?  sh has escaping to deal with spaces
(18:29:18) mjl-: ah
(18:29:31) mjl-: i'm not really surprised by that
(18:29:40) GriffenJBS: not exactly sure if it's a mk problem or sh
(18:29:52) GriffenJBS: I know on gnu systems it's a make problem
(18:31:07) mjl-: i think we call it a user problem in inferno :P
(18:31:41) GriffenJBS: is there a such thing as unbind?
(18:31:47) anth: unmount
(18:31:58) GriffenJBS: mount and bind are undone by unmount?
(18:32:02) anth: yup
(18:32:12) anth: er...
(18:32:19) GriffenJBS: an alias of unbind to unmount may be an idea
(18:32:21) anth: they are in plan9. i'm not 100% sure that's ture in inferno.
(18:32:29) anth: s/ture/true
(18:33:08) anth: well, it's clearly *an* idea. ;-)
(18:33:12) GriffenJBS: after playing with perl ture reads a true
(18:33:57) GriffenJBS: anth, just trying to get the learning curve a little more linear
(18:37:17) GriffenJBS: http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn63/RC51_John/EVE/EveLearningCurve.jpg
(18:49:09) anth: i dare you to come up with the function that graph represents. :-)
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(18:57:03) GriffenJBS: Z(n+1) = Zn^2 + c where |-0.4 < z < 6|
(18:57:23) GriffenJBS: opps where |-0.4 < Z < 6|
(18:59:22) anth: cute. :-)
(19:00:22) GriffenJBS: :-) mandelbrot with a range
(19:01:51) anth: yeah - i had to look it up.
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