Conversation with #inferno at Tue Jul 31 23:27:15 2012 on powerman-asdf@irc.freenode.net (irc)
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(22:38:37) infernjo: inferno is so cool... i wish we were using the 2012 version of it rather than java
(22:39:21) infernjo: i've asked here before (because i'm not sure how to), but it would be nice to have a "killer app" for inferno
(22:47:13) leetspete: infernjo: It's true.  For me, the killer app was the shell.
(22:47:46) infernjo: hey, are you the dude who wrote the nifty blog posts about security and the shell?
(22:48:10) leetspete: That's me. And thanks. :)
(22:49:26) leetspete: I've been toying with an HTTP client and reading over the supplied HTTP server.  I'm not a huge fan of web stuff, but it is the lingua franca of the internet at large.
(22:52:39) infernjo: nice! good stuff there. i'm a c/embedded guy and i spend lots of time with the lua language. while i've managed to slip lua (and before that forth) into my products. the recurring theme for me has been to get the c/asm code to the point to have a shell or scripting language to a point to connect pieces together (the "unix" philosophy). inferno seems freaking awesome for that
(22:53:10) infernjo: w.r.t. web stuff, it's wonky but it's what we have, right?
(22:54:32) infernjo: i can't fully articulate what i'm thinking of, but some kind of inferno-driven web-based gui has been bubbling around in my head for a while... maybe something like connecting the DOM tree via 9p/styx on a mutated websocket
(22:54:57) leetspete: I love Lua and Forth!
(22:54:59) infernjo: no code yet (too many other projects) but i keep hoping that if i think about it long enough, someone will write it ;)
(22:57:24) leetspete: I'd planned something similar to the browser architecture you described; I had some friends that wanted to do a browser like that.  I think you could come up with a much smaller codebase than FF or Webkit if the DOM worked like that.  CSS process to bounce around and alter the nodes, etc.
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(22:58:51) leetspete: Porting the parser, it might be possible to use the Javascript runtime in Charon to run Lua.  They've got pretty similar semantics, but I don't know how married to Javascript jscript.b actually is.
(22:59:27) leetspete: I know what you mean about the number of projects.
(22:59:36) infernjo: i work for a "big semiconductor company" who is pushing the android stack (out of necessity) but i really cringe at all the bloat. now, i'm not perfect or anything, but i do think i have a feel for elegance -vs- crud and the whole linux community seems to be collecting a lot of crud
(23:00:27) infernjo: well, i'm wimping out on my approach in that i'd use a normal browser to connect up to a "headless" inferno instance and present the WM over DOM/canvas/etc
(23:00:52) infernjo: but a beefed up (not crudded up) charon would be nice too.
(23:01:41) infernjo: if i remember correctly, there's a rudimentry c to limbo translator that might do a decent job with lua
(23:01:52) leetspete: Oh, interesting.  I'd been thinking of cobbling something together with VNC, actually.
(23:02:22) leetspete: Couldn't agree more.  I usually run CRUX, but even then, the amount of crud required to get a full-featured browser will absolutely bury any simplicity (or what passes for it) you manage to retain.
(23:02:28) infernjo: hmm VNC... that's pretty interesting. you'd get lots of client for "free"
(23:03:08) infernjo: i have to plead ignorance on whether or not you can connect up a plan9 drawterm to inferno or not.
(23:03:11) leetspete: Unrelated, but if you like Lua, you might be interested in Luakit:  http://mason-larobina.github.com/luakit/
(23:03:24) infernjo: is that webkit+lua?
(23:03:27) leetspete: Yep.
(23:03:33) infernjo: neat
(23:04:21) infernjo: you a developer, student, or hobbiest?
(23:04:37) infernjo: (or some combo?)
(23:05:13) leetspete: I don't think it's possible to wire up P9's drawterm to Inferno, due to the auth stuff, possibly lack of interest, since Inferno seems to get thought of as a toy too often.
(23:05:27) leetspete: I'm a coder, I've done mostly web stuff.
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